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 Post subject: Fully Rested and WotLK
PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 12:19 am  
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In just a few days, Wrath will hit the store shelves, and a mass-exodus from BC to Northrend will occur. In short, everything changes. I wanted to post some thoughts and open a dialog with the guild about our future in a post-LK game.

Direction
Naturally the guild is going to scatter a bit over the next couple months as people level up to 80 at each person's individual pace. If history repeats itself, some of the quick-to-level folks will help out the slower folks, and we'll find ourselves breaking into 10-man Naxx in relatively short order.

The vast majority of folks in the guild are working professionals who'd like to see the end-game content. As one of the officers, I feel a sense of responsibility in letting the guild down in this regard for BC. WotLK will give us a chance to wipe the slate clean and start anew -- and I speak for all the officers when I say that we are resolved to conquer ALL that LK has to offer, and ensure all of our FR family gets to see this content in its fullest!
To that end, we are committed to taking the time to learn the new encounters, gear up our raiders, and make the game fun for both ourselves and all of you as well.

Fortunately, LK seems to be quite linear in progression, so we should not find ourselves divided as we were in BC's Hyjal and Black Temple.

Now, there's a downside to linear ... folks will get bored with an encounter, especially after they've won the loot from it. I can't even count how many times we'd run a 25-man, and folks that were bored with it, or didn't need the loot, decided to stop coming after they'd gotten what they wanted from it. The bottom line is -- you got your loot because 24 other people volunteered their time to get it for you. The very least you can do is return the favor! I will say that this occurred with a small minority of folks. Most of our regular raiders showed up night after night, for better or worse -- you guys are the BACKBONE of our raids!

We are, and will continue to be, a casual guild. Raiding is always optional. We're not going to get upset if you go on a PUG or have a bad hair day and don't feel like raiding that night. We're all adults here and this is just a game. We're going to continue to do 25-mans (when we're sufficiently geared) a couple nights a week, and have 10-mans interspersed throughout the remainder. It is our hope that you don't rely too heavily on the officers to organize 10-mans. If however, the general consensus is that an officer would be the preferred organizer, then I have no problem volunteering to be the offical Raid Organizer and I'll be happy to partition people into 10-mans as necessary on any given night.

The current direction of the officers is to accelerate to 25-man status at a reasonably fast rate, and begin navigating through 25-man content as efficiently as possible. My personal opinion (having not discussed with the other officers) is that we should farm 25-man Naxx until we're regularly sharding loot, and transition to the next zone. What I don't want to have happen is for everyone to just get 1-2 pieces of Naxx loot before moving onto the next dungeon. Folks start wanting to go back all the time, and it distracts from the end goal of finishing the game. As a casual guild, I recognize that we will (because of our nature) be forced to go back to Naxx for a while, even after progressing past it -- whether it be due to player rotations, or recruiting efforts, or player schedules. Ideally, everyone will get what they want out of 25-man Naxx, we'll move on, and go back infrequently when necessary. I've no idea how reality will play out on this.

Loot
DKP has been completely wiped -- all characters (not logins) as well. When we start doing 25-mans again in LK, we'll either resurrect that site, or decide as a guild how loot is going to be handled again. Most people prefer DKP -- but this is a discussion we can have at a later date. One thing is for certain -- 25-man loot will be quite interesting with the way the dungeons are staggered between 10 and 25 man raids. We're not even sure DKP will or should apply and are adopting a "wait and see" attitude regarding loot distribution in LK.

There are no set-in-stone loot rules for 10mans and my personal feeling is that it should stay that way. I think 10 people in a raid can come to a quick consensus on loot, which generally ends up being some variation of NBG anyway.

Recruiting
None of us knows at this point how much (if any) recruiting we'll have to do. If we do have to recruit, I'd prefer to do some kind of sponsorship thing rather than plucking people off the streets or inviting anyone who puts in an app with only a cursory review. I don't really have many firm ideas on this yet -- but I'd like to make sure that we avoid personality conflicts and are a little more stubborn in our evaluation of new recruits. The "eh, they're not good, but not bad, I guess we'll keep them" mentality needs to be revised. We've run into this issue several times where we've been on the fence regarding a recruit, but let them stay anyway. IMO they either impress us and we keep them, or they don't and we cut them loose. No middle ground.

Our goal is to have 25 reliable raiders who show up consistently, and we'll recruit as little or as much as needed to get there. We want to avoid having a queue, but realize its inevitable for a casual guild. We can't be both casual and consistent! Queues are no fun. It's no fun to be there, it's no fun having to put someone there. It sucks. The more consistent our raiders are, the less additional people we'll have to recruit, and the less number of people we'll ever have to queue.


Yes, it's a cat ... being fed through a meatgrinder by a deranged, hockey mask-wearing pig. Draw your own conclusions.
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 12:49 am  
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Another point of view on looting and raiding is this:
We farm a 25-man dungeon until we have sufficient gear to eek by in the next 25-man dungeon. We learn and farm that dungeon until we can eek by into the next dungeon, and so on until we get to the top-end final dungeon of the game ... then we farm the heck out of the final dungeon of the game until everyone has everything they could possibly want from it.

Of course, that only works if we keep advancing.


Yes, it's a cat ... being fed through a meatgrinder by a deranged, hockey mask-wearing pig. Draw your own conclusions.
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 10:35 am  
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 10:57 am
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howdy!

haven't been around much, quit playing about 8 months ago but definitely going to give wotlk a try. i hadn't done hardly any research on it until these past few days.. and i must say i'm actually pretty excited. been playing WAR lately, but that game just isn't quite up to the quality it needs to be yet, so might as well re-activate my WoW account and see what northrend has to offer.

so i don't really know where the guild is at or anything that's been going on lately.. but just wanted to say that i pretty much agree with everything jarr said, especially in regards to recruiting. in order for us to succeed with only 2-3 raid nights a week... it's imperative that we have top notch players... other guilds that raid more often can get by with less skilled players because they have more time to practice, we don't have that luxury so we really do need to be more stringent with recruiting.

well that's my 2 copper.

see ya in northrend in a few days!

- Zirk/Zamza


Zamza - Gnome Mage
Flik - Dwarven Hunter
Zirk - Gnome Warlock
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 11:40 pm  
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I think everyone who reads this should keep in mind. For 25 mans we have been raiding 6 hours a week. I assume this wont change. But who knows. My Point though is its ONLY 6 hours. We need to keep that in mind and make the most of those 6 hours.

Being Prepared
Wipe Recovery
Are the 2 most important ones. The less time we spend running back, buffing and explaining fights the more bosses we will get down in those 6 hours.
We have as good as any players on the server we just don't raid as much. No reason we can't see all of the content.


I dont think the way we do 10 mans should change other than what jarr said. Don't assume an officer will start a 10 man every night. Even if we tried there would be no way we could get everyone who wanted to go into a raid each night. Keep that in mind. Be willing to help and have fun. And we will go far as a guild.


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